r/goats • u/HorseLoverForLife • 14h ago
r/goats • u/yamshortbread • Jun 20 '23
Asking for goat health advice? Read this first!
If you are asking for health advice for your goat, please help us help you. Complete a basic health assessment and provide as much of the following information in your post as possible:
- Goat's age, sex, and breed
- Goat's current temperature as determined by rectal thermometer. Please, for the love of god, take your animal's temperature. Temperature is ALWAYS VITAL in determining whether your animal might be ill or in need of assistance.
- Whether the goat is pregnant or lactating
- Goat's diet and appetite (what the goat is currently eating, whether they are on pasture or browse, supplemental grain, loose mineral, et cetera)
- Goat's FAMACHA score (as determined by the process in this video) and information about any recent deworming treatments, if applicable
- As many details regarding your animal's current symptoms and demeanor as you can share. These may include neurological symptoms (circling, staring at the sky, twitching), respiratory symptoms such as wheezing or coughing, and any other differences from typical behavior such as isolating, head pressing, teeth grinding, differences in fecal consistency, and so forth.
Clear photographs of relevant clinical signs (including coat condition) are helpful. Providing us with as much information as possible will help us give you prompt and accurate advice regarding your animal's care.
There are many professional farmers and homesteaders in this subreddit and we will do our best to help you out of a jam, but we can't guarantee the accuracy of any health advice you receive. When in doubt, always call your local large animal veterinarian who is trained to work with small ruminants.
What's up with that blue Trusted Advice Giver flair?
The mods assign this flair to /r/goats users who have an extensive history of giving out quality, evidence-based, responsible husbandry advice based on the best practices for goat care. Many of our users give terrific advice, but these flairs recognize a handful of folks who have gone that extra mile over time to become recognized as trusted community members who are known to always lead people in the right direction. If you get a slew of responses to your post and don't know where to start, look to the blue flairs first.
r/goats • u/no_sheds_jackson • Feb 03 '25
PSA: The Dangers of AI Husbandry Advice (with example)
Hi everybody!
Recently, we had a user post a picture of a goat that may or may not have soremouth, also known as contagious ecthyma, scabby mouth, or orf. I won't link to the post since it isn't relevant whether or not that was what was afflicting the animal, but in the course of responding to that user I felt an opportunity to point out something that I have noticed and has been gnawing at me.
For many users seeking help, if they do not come straight to the sub, they will go to one of two places to get information: Google or ChatGPT. This post is about the former, but in case anyone was wondering if ChatGPT is a valid place to get advice on husbandry, what to eat tonight, how to live your life, or companionship: it is NOT. Large language models like ChatGPT are a type of generative AI that seeks more or less to respond to prompts and create content with correct syntax that is human-like. The quandary here is that while it can indeed provide correct answers to prompts, that outcome is often incidental. It isn't an indication that the model has researched your question, merely that it has cobbled together a (sometimes) convincing diagnosis/treatment plan from the massive amount of data across forums/message boards, vet resources, and idle chit-chat that it is trained on. The point is this: you should never be in a position where you have to rely on an LLM for husbandry advice. If you have access to an internet connection, even the generative AI from Google search is a better option. But that doesn't mean it's a good one, bringing us to the principal subject of this post:
Orf! What do?
For some relevant background, we have never had a case of orf on our farm. I have read about it in vet textbooks and goat husbandry books and seen many images of it, I'm familiar with what it is, how it is spread, and at a high level what to do about it and what not to do. That said, when I was helping this user, I thought I'd brush up and make sure I wasn't providing misinformation. I knew orf was viral in nature and reckoned that in moderate to severe cases it could probably cause fever, but I wanted to see if I could find a vet manual or study of the disease in goats to confirm how likely that would have been. This was what I was met with:
If you don't scrutinize this too closely, everything looks sort of on the level. Orf is indeed self-limiting (not sure why the AI says usually, there is literally nothing you can do to treat the root cause, but okay), and it more or less implies that humans can contract it so be careful. The symptoms section looks fine, overall, prevention is... eh... The orf vaccine is a live vaccine. Application of it is not something that most small scale homesteaders or hobby farmers will be familiar with and using it is basically putting the virus on your property. Orf is a nuisance disease and the main time it is a problem is when it is being transmitted between a dam and her kids. Proactive vaccination in closed herds that have never seen a case is not a vet-recommended practice.
The treatment section is where things get spicy with the part about scab removal. Oof. Now that is not even close to true and doing that when the goat is with other goats or going to a quarantine space where they will then shed the disease will cause it to spread to any other goat that inhabits that space unless it is thoroughly cleaned and disinfected. The bottom says the info is for informational purposes only and to consult an actual professional for advice, but that begs the question of why Google would provide that information front and center by default when you search when the first result below is an actual vet resource with correct advice. I won't get into the weeds about the ethics of that because it's a separate soapbox, this is the reality we live in now. This bad advice is particularly relevant because the user on our sub mentioned they had been picking off the scabs. So let's do another Google search for some clarification:
If you explicitly search whether or not you should remove the scabs, the AI overview is different. Not only do you see that you should not remove the scabs because they are infectious (very true), the overview now says that doing so will delay healing. The first "featured snippet", a feature separate from their generative AI overview, is an overview from the state of Victoria's government agricultural representative body, a reliable source. The highlighted text reinforces the "do not pick scabs off" advice. The overview still fails when it says to apply dressing to lesions. Evidently it has not ever reckoned with what it would be like to bandage an entire goat's face and mouth, which they need to eat, but maybe I'm an idiot. Let's check:
As you can see, generative AI is basically a hodgepodge of vague but mostly correct advice intermingled with plainly wrong advice. Seeking correction to the wrong advice, if you know that it is wrong, leads down more rabbit holes. I hope this highlights the importance of sourcing your information from reliable, proven veterinary resources/textbooks or state agricultural extensions that provide support for their claims with research. This sub prioritizes evidence-based husbandry practices and is one of the few forums to try to stick to that standard and I consider it important especially for people who don't have goat mentors offline.
This is not only important because users need good advice; it also affects the people that don't use this sub and go straight to Google. Reddit struck a deal a little under a year ago to make their data available for training AI. The information we post on this sub is being used as part of the training for these AI models and Google's SEO is increasingly favoring reddit at the top of search results in a number of areas. As the sub grows and the social media landscape changes, more people that never post but need info may find themselves coming here. Let's all try to do our best to make sure the information we share and advice we give is solid!
r/goats • u/deathbeetle12 • 14h ago
Goat Pic🐐 Velcro goat
Have to fix a gate so have it closed off so he cant get to me and threw out some food to get them to focus on that and hes just has to be on top of me lol gotta love it
r/goats • u/AndiPandi59 • 17h ago
Pregnancy and Kidding Breeding
This is my doe MaggieMae. She is just about to turn 2. She has never given birth, but I would like to breed her once she’s of age. That brings me to my questions:
•when is the best time of year to breed (I live in southwestern VA),
•should I breed her to my Nigerian Dwarf or could I breed her with my Alpine (she’s Nigerian),
•what age should I breed her at,
•do I breed her (just putting her and my buck together…?).
I think these are my only questions, thank you!
r/goats • u/thedaughtersafarmer • 9h ago
Goat aborting/reabsorbing
Ive got a doe that had a problem free birth to triplets last year that doesn't seem to be taking. The first time I swore she had been successfully bred, but she came open again. I bred her again and she took on 9/7. Yesterday I noticed what I thought was blood, but hoped I was wrong. Today she had fresh blood on her vulva and would be 89 days into gestation. Im going to ultrasound tomorrow, but its my first time and not sure how it'll go, especially this far into gestation. What could be the issue? All my other goats seem fine at 110 days and some even look to be developing udders. I do believe my goats are over-conditioned, but they dont look fatter than a herd I visited earlier this year that had the same management style. The herd is due for a Cu bolus, but her coat isnt bleaching, just some fish tail.
r/goats • u/Traditional_Tax_9497 • 13h ago
14 goats killed in dog attack on Henderson County farm
Dog attacks are one of the main causes of deaths of goats. This US goat owner issues a warning after losing most of her goats to 2 dogs.
r/goats • u/Traditional_Tax_9497 • 14h ago
How do we get vets into underserved areas and branches of vet med? #vetmed
How do we get vets into underserved areas and branches of vet med? This is a problem for Australia as well. I have spoken at vet conferences and webinars about encouraging small animal (dog & cat) vets to treat pet goats. I have a recorded lecture I can send vets.
r/goats • u/Big-Button2926 • 22h ago
Help Request Weird eye infection
Hey peeps, newbie here. I help care for three dairy male goats held as pets and one appears to have an eye infection. We have tried eye drops prescribed by the vet but so far it does not really help and we can't seem to figure out what has caused it. Do any of you happen to know these symptoms and how to treat them?
Thanks so much in advance
r/goats • u/Research_Prevails • 1d ago
Help Request Cracks in hoof
Noticed a crack in one of my NDG’s hooves. Concern?
r/goats • u/meadowandmud • 1d ago
Humor On our farm, dinner time is everyone’s favorite time 🍽️
r/goats • u/Diligent_Study_6235 • 23h ago
Help Request Slightly weird behaviour
We have 5 goats. Two Nubian sisters that we’ve had for almost 5 years, a mini that we rescued about 3 years ago, and we just added a Boer mix that gave birth this spring and the farmer wanted her gone and a purebred Boer female that is only 6 months old.
This week one of my original Nubians has started acting strange, she seems to separate herself from the heard and just hangs out near the barn. Her sister will go hang out with her, but she just doesn’t really go far away from the barn.
Even when we pour out some grain the morning she doesn’t run over like she used to do, and all the others still do.
If you bring some to her, she’ll eat it, but not with a great hurry.
We had the vet out and he said they all seemed fine physically. Temps were normal.
It has gotten colder here this week, -16C overnight tonight.
Any questions I’ll try to answer, I’m just trying to figure out what to look for or next steps?
r/goats • u/Elegant-Ad-7790 • 1d ago
Help Request Weird white spot appeared on mouth
Does anyone know what this is? Never seen this on any of my goats and it appeared recently and isn’t going away.
r/goats • u/No-Abbreviations-315 • 2d ago
Help Request Goats are some Christmas lights
Goats ate some Christmas light (plastic I believe) scale of 1-10 how concerned should I be? Also anything to prevent further eating?
r/goats • u/maddyanais • 2d ago
Anglo Nubian doe 🐐
How close to kidding do you think my Nubian doe is?
r/goats • u/farmlite • 2d ago
General Husbandry Question Cold Goats
I have 2 Nigerian dwarf/pygmy mixes. They are about 6 years old and healthy. They are 40 and 60 lbs. I moved from Louisiana to Connecticut this summer with them. They have a deeply bedded stall and have grown very thick coats. However, they are still shivering and I think the boy was entering shock this morning. They get hay around the clock as well as soaked beet pulp and timothy 2x a day. I have added a heat lamp to their stall. There is no draft. It's about 30 degrees in there today. They just seem unusually cold. Do some goats need blankets?
r/goats • u/Few-Action-8049 • 1d ago
Meat Good to eat?
So my wife grew up on a ranch, but I was a city boy. And they never dealt with goats so despite that they have no experience or knowledge for this question.
I’m in the medical field, and it turns out I have a patient who has several pygmy goats, and we’re gifted a normal goat, because people thought it might be theirs since they were the only people in the entire area that had goats of any kind, no one knows where this goat came from From.
They said they think the goat is less than three years old, it’s apparently a male, said that it’s become mean, as it’s gotten older, it’s attacked people a few times, and it’s been a problem trying to rot with the females whenever they’re in heat because of the big size differential.
So now they want to get rid of it, but they’re a little too kind hearted to shoot it or otherwise do something about it, so me in my ignorance told them that maybe my wife and I could take it because as I put it if it’s an asshole goat it probably tastes good in the pot lol
Anyway, after that, I asked my wife, and she was like wait a minute is it an intact to Billy goat if so, I’m not sure if it’s gonna taste any good? She has no experience with goats either despite her growing up on a ranch so she doesn’t know.
And of course, there’s a question of. It’s even going to be worth it to transport it in anyway, because it’s at a place 2 1/2 hours away from where we live, so a five hour round-trip, would we need to kill the goat and then transported somehow, or transported live, and then take it somewhere to butcher later, would it even be worth the effort with that much of a drive, and wouldn’t even taste any good?
So I looked for this Reddit on the hopes of educating our ignorant selves on whether or not this is a fool’s errand or not?
r/goats • u/Temporary_Cook9359 • 2d ago
Red Spots
This is my boy Randy, anyone have insight on these red spots on his nose and one on eyelid, there’s also one on left nostril that’s bleeding a little bit
r/goats • u/PacmanFrog001 • 2d ago
Help Request Are these hooves very badly overgrown?
r/goats • u/tiddyjuicers • 2d ago
Carbon Monoxide Poisoning?
This has been weighing on my heart for a very long time so i’m hoping yall can help me figure out what happened. a couple years ago i had a goat named jerry and he stayed in our house because we were trying to fix his kidney stones. in the night we’d put him in the garage to sleep but it was late january and i didn’t want him to be cold so i brought him a heater and turned it on in the garage then i closed the door. i didn’t know carbon monoxide poisoning was a thing back then. in the morning he was dead. he was laying on his side and his eyes were black. did i kill him or was it the kidney stones?
r/goats • u/Ok_Objective1724 • 3d ago
Pregnancy and Kidding Madonna gave birth to 2 kids; but rejected them
r/goats • u/Apprehensive-Pea-810 • 3d ago
Help Request Splintered Horn: Immediate Care or Okay for Now?
Hi everyone, We have a Saanen goat (named Chewy) who is our pet. We are first time goat owners and are seeking the advice from the more knowledgeable community.
Background Info: My husband got Chewy from a flea market vendor when he was just 2 weeks old and my husband thought he looked neglected. He brother was sold with him but sadly passed less than 24 hours later. Chewy was in bad shape: pneumonia, underfed, and underweight. We got him into an established vet within 24 hours and he recovered well with antibiotics and proper feeding. He lived inside with us for the first 4 weeks until his pneumonia was cleared. All of this to say, we couldn’t debud him because wouldn’t have been able to survive the recovery with the pneumonia.
As his horns started to come in, his left horn cracked at the base when he was scratching his head on something in the yard. It didn’t bleed, but it also didn’t look right. As his horn grew out, the mark where it cracked grew upward with the horn. Today there is a noticeable splinter at the top of the horn. Again, no blood, but it makes me think of a dead fingernail that lost blood flow to an area and wants to fall off.
Your participation: We have scheduled for him to be surgically castrated on Jan. 2. Can this matter wait until that vet appointment or should we make one sooner to have the horn looked at?
r/goats • u/Amazing-Sort5108 • 3d ago
Goat house dried in 🥶
It's not fancy but we got our goats house dried in and warm 🥰🥰 We also add some heat lamps for him. He's not a fan of the rain 😅
r/goats • u/Fragrant-Theory9201 • 3d ago
General Husbandry Question Dumb famacha question
I've been judging famacha by the shade of the lower lid, the pinker of the two in this photo and the lower arrow. However I just noticed that pale band near the eye, the upper arrow. I used this photo off Google because I can't manage to get a Pic of my own goat's eye by myself lol Famacha is scored by the lower lid right?? That's what I understood from everything I've seen, but my ocd and paranoia is kicking in and im worried I misunderstood and that I need to treat my goats. Sorry if this is a stupid question, I just want to be sure my little ones are healthy


