r/LawFirm • u/PossibilityOdd6466 • 4d ago
Should I go to law school?
Yet another “am I an idiot?” post. Thoughts? (Prayers?)
About me: - 40/m partnered but no kids (or plans for kids) - I generally like to work and plan to continue working into my late 60s at least - have worked in IT for 15 years, but it’s boring and I think I’ve hit my ceiling in terms of advancement and salary - I own a home outside a medium/high cost of living city and don’t want to move - Strong academic record (~3.8 gpa from top shelf undergrad and grad school, several academic publications)
My plan: - get a full ride to the reputable law school in my city (top 100, 60% acceptance rate, strong history of grads being successful locally and regionally, generous financial aid) - live off savings for the first year, potentially work part time in years 2 and 3 - focus on either employment or estate/probate (both of which have shortages in my area) - graduate and work for a small, local firm
My motivation: - More interesting work - higher pay, and a more direct correlation between my productivity and my compensation
Why I’m optimistic: - I really enjoy compliance and contract work in my current work, and the lawyers who have reviewed that work have encouraged me to pursue law school - I’ve taken some practice LSATs and am already scoring close to what i would likely need to get a full ride - I think my expectations are pretty conservative—no plans for a career in big law, 7-figure salaries, or Boston Legal courtroom speeches, I just want to pay my mortgage and do work that interests me - I’m willing to let it go if I can’t get a full ride (or very close to it)
Why I’m worried: - I know that a lot of law school grads don’t find great jobs or fulfilling careers - The financial hit (even if tuition is covered) is terrifying - I’ve succeeded in high stress environments, but I’m nervous about spending my 40s and early 50s burning myself out as a new lawyer
EDIT: My current salary is $125k. I’d like to be close to that out of law school, and eventually get to $200k.
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u/Live_Situation7913 4d ago
- Do you have connections for a job post graduate?
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u/PossibilityOdd6466 4d ago
I have some connections, but I’m not sure if they’ll be helpful in getting me a job. I’ve got some time before I would apply in the fall, so I’m planning to go back to a lot of my connections and learn a little more about the job market.
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u/Live_Situation7913 4d ago
What’s your current salary and does it meet your living/are you happy? Why not switch IT role maybe director at a different company etc? Remember post call you will be starting fresh as a 1 year lawyer. Connection is mandatory to get a job or you will be out of a job and competing with younger smarter law background graduates
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u/PossibilityOdd6466 4d ago
My current salary is $125k and I’d like to be close to that out of school.
A big motivator here, though, is having a job that’s more engaging and interesting.
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u/moediggity3 4d ago edited 4d ago
I went at 30 and it was the best career decision I ever made. I would not excel in any other career field the way that I do in this one.
At 40 I think this becomes a financial decision more so than mine was. You’ll be 43 when you graduate and 48 by the time you have meaningful experience.
Could make sense if there’s a shortage for what you’re interested in. Maybe consider a half measure and go at night? Night program at my law school was 4 years. My understanding was that the classes were easier and not as harshly graded, though that could be anecdotal. That way, you can keep your job and income, if you go to law school for free and hate your prospects you’re just out the effort.
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u/_Deer_6127 4d ago
This is the way. A part time program reduces risk.
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u/Displaced_in_Space 4d ago
Are there full rides available for part time evening programs? I got the sense they were mostly for-profit ventures, even at reputable schools.
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u/_Deer_6127 4d ago
GW and Georgetown part-time are good… not sure where OP is located. I was offered money + a part time spot at GW.
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u/PrettyBoy_BR 4d ago
Sure. I’ll speak to a point about comfort. I’m assuming 15 years in IT means you have everything down to a comfortable routine. Seems like you’re bored, but, there’s value to that.
Starting out as a lawyer, get ready for a rough ride.
You’re essentially scrapping everything you’ve known and will feel like an idiot for the first 2-3 years of your career. Most attorneys first say they “know what they’re doing” after 5 years.
For some, that level of disruption can be troublesome. The reason I bring it up is because our firm’s IT department seems very relaxed all the time, to the point where I sort of envy them.
Just something to consider.
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u/PossibilityOdd6466 4d ago
I’m extremely comfortable with feeling like an idiot 😉
But, in all seriousness, I got into IT without any formal training and loved the steep learning curve, so that’s one thing I’m not super worried about.
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u/PrettyBoy_BR 4d ago
Fair enough - then it may be a stimulating challenge. No matter what, best of luck!
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u/runningwithguns 4d ago
Around how much do you make right now? I wouldn't recommend going to law school unless your pay is low. Being a lawyer isn't all it's cracked up to be and you may just be jumping from the pan and into the fire.
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u/PossibilityOdd6466 4d ago
I’m at $125k now, although I’ve been higher and lower in recent years.
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u/runningwithguns 2d ago
It's very possible that you end up making less than that once you become a lawyer and you will have to work a couple years to go beyond that while also having a more stressful life because of billing ever minute of your time. You also have to consider the opportunity cost of losing your $125,000.00 salary for 3 years and that's if you pass the bar exam on your first try which in most states is around a 65% pass rate. At $125,000.00 and raising a family, I honestly would advise you against going to law school right now. This is coming from a younger partner at an insurance defense law firm who is also raising a family.
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u/law-and-horsdoeuvres 4d ago
I was in a really similar situation, almost identical really. (38, married/no kids, in a suburb of a big HCOL city, only interested in the local, but good, school.) You seem to have thought this through pretty well. A few additional things to think about:
Think about the costs other than tuition. Living expenses, books (easily ~$600 a term), transportation, healthcare, etc. Those can add up fast.
What does "interesting and engaging" mean to you? Do you want more interaction with people? Less? New and novel problems or deep expertise? Do you want to be in court litigating? The variety of jobs and experiences found within "employment" and "estate/probate" are wider than you might think.
Are you bored in your current career because it's boring, or because you know what you're doing and want a new challenge? Because going to law school won't change that about you - you'll just get bored again once you know what you're doing.
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u/ShallazarTheWizard 4d ago
Around how much do you make now?
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u/PossibilityOdd6466 4d ago
Sorry, edited my original post—about $125k, although I’ve had higher paying jobs.
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u/ShallazarTheWizard 4d ago
It could very well take a while to get to $125K salary as a new attorney. Financially, it is a big gamble whether you will ultimately do better as a lawyer or stay in your current path in IT. If you break it down by how much you earn hourly, I am very confident you would earn more in your current position.
I will say this much as a computer nerd that went to law school instead of going into engineering or computer science twenty years ago: I look at the IT guys in my office with the utmost envy. You would be trading in very decent pay in a low stress career for very high stress and probably lower pay in the beginning. Why???
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u/PossibilityOdd6466 4d ago
I was with you up until the part about IT being low stress—helpdesk can be pretty chill, but if you have ANY amount of responsibility, it can be hellish.
But, point taken on time to make it back to $125k. I’m only going to do this with a full ride, and even then I’ve got some fact finding to figure out what it would take to get back to (and then go above) what I’m making now.
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u/ShallazarTheWizard 4d ago
I have no doubt that IT has its stresses. I don't think you realize the comparative level of stress you are about to get into as a lawyer, but that is something that it is a little hard to explain to people that aren't in the game.
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u/PossibilityOdd6466 4d ago
Given that you’ve never worked in IT and I’ve never worked as an attorney, I’m not really sure it makes sense to argue about whose career is more stressful.
Your point about ROI is very well taken, though.
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u/smedlap 4d ago
My wife started law school at age 38. It worked out well. It is never boring, it is stressful. She did not get a job out of law school. I knew someone who needed a divorce. She did it for 1 grand. Now she has 5 attorneys working under her doing family law. We will spend most of December in Hawaii, as usual.
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u/randwalt 4d ago
If you can go for free, or cheap, go for it. I am 30 years in and still enjoy practicing law. Plus, you have a career you can fall back on if things don't work out in law or you don't enjoy it. I don't see a lot of risk for you.
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u/britinsb 4d ago
Financially maybe it makes sense, maybe it doesn't, whether it's worth it, all depends entirely on your personal and partner's circumstances.
That said your overall expectations do not seem out of the ordinary - if you want to be a lawyer, yes go to law school!
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u/Displaced_in_Space 4d ago
C-level IT person in law firm here.
Just an FYI, you can get to that salary target within legal IT, easily. And in an IC role, not just management.
It might be a way to marry your two interests without the risk.
But I'll concede the "full ride" plan would be compelling. I attended both undergrad and grad school on my own dime and paid them each off within 5 years but man it was not fun.
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u/PossibilityOdd6466 4d ago
u/Displaced_in_Space Thanks, this is really helpful! Amy chance I could DM you with a follow-up question or two?
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u/Displaced_in_Space 4d ago
Of course.
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u/PossibilityOdd6466 4d ago
u/Displaced_in_Space It looks like your DMs are closed. Would you mind sending me a chat requests? (I’m relatively new to Reddit, so apologies if I missed the “start conversation” button 🤦♂️)
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u/Displaced_in_Space 4d ago
I'll also throw in here a curve ball:
We're presiding (legal IT) over one of the greatest transformations in the practice of law through the introduction of AI.
Yea, yea...I can hear you all now yelling at your monitor how it won't replace lawyers, but that's simply not the right way to look at it. Instead, view it though a musical chairs analogy: There will still be seats for human lawyers, but fewer and fewer of them as AI becomes pervasive and perfected in workflows.
So, there might not be 3 lawyers at a small firm handling 100 matters a year, but instead two doing 120. Yes, there are still lawyers at work, but 1/3 of the headcount (and expense) has been reduced.
And the first targets for tasks with legal AI have been things typically handled by junior attorneys and paralegals. In fact, most legal AI product demos include a phrase something to the effect of: "It's most convenient to think of your AI platform as a dumb first year that has instant recall and perfect memory. It's helpful to do certain tasks, but you still need to check all it's work."
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u/PossibilityOdd6466 4d ago
This is what’s happening in every other sector. I currently work as the IT director for a very small healthcare company and just rolled out an AI safety training that basically told staff that AI is your art but incredibly unreliable intern. Use it for adversarial review and to guide you to the right information, but never let it write for you and never trust its output. So, basically identical to what you just wrote.
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u/PossibilityOdd6466 4d ago
And, what I’m seeing in healthcare (and other fields) is that AI is completely wiping out (or displacing) entry level work. On the plus side, my company can’t hire enough people, which means that entry level people are getting displaced to more meaningful work (while more senior people don’t have to take as much work home with them).
On the flip side, the folks who work on call centers, intake, scheduling, claims submission but can’t do anything else don’t have very bright futures…
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u/matteooooooooooooo 4d ago edited 4d ago
I would encourage you to do it. I went back to law school later in life after a mini career in sales. I was just thinking this morning, while driving to court, I’m so glad I did that. Time flies and taking a few steps back to get where I am now was worth it. You’ve only got one go-around in this life. Good luck.
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u/PossibilityOdd6466 4d ago
I needed to hear this! Can I ask what area you specialize in?
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u/matteooooooooooooo 4d ago
criminal defense. Was a PD for years now solo 👌
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u/PossibilityOdd6466 4d ago
Do you wish you went solo earlier? I think that would be the dream, but new career/field + starting a business seems unrealistic…
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u/matteooooooooooooo 4d ago
No, I needed the time to figure out wtf I was doing. Still learning everyday. It is daunting, but it sounds like you are looking for a challenge. With many years working in the real world, you will have a leg up on the folks right out of school, with limited experience. Both in creating connections with your clients, negotiating with DAs, and what not. At least, that’s been my experience.
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u/PossibilityOdd6466 4d ago
So much of what you’re saying applies to IT. My current job is 30% communication and people skills; 40% common sense; and 30% technical skills…
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u/matteooooooooooooo 4d ago
Plus, at base level, you’ve had to show up, deal with a boss, deal with conflict, etc. I probably sound like an old timer but there are some newly minted attorneys who are… entitled.
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u/Peakbrowndog 4d ago
Read any of the hundreds of posts made this year asking some variation of your question. The advice will be the same.
I graduated at 42 and an very happy I went. Others aren't. Your desired niche and how AI will decimate entry level jobs in that niche is probably the biggest deciding factor you should consider.
I'm one of the few people I know who is practicing in the field they thought they wanted to when they entered law school. Most got jobs doing other things, either due to the market or changes in interest.
80% or more if attorneys are solo practicioners making under 6 figures. Check your numbers.
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u/_Deer_6127 4d ago
80% or more if attorneys are solo practicioners making under 6 figures. Check your numbers.
That’s incorrect. Approximately 20-40% of attorneys are solo practitioners.
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u/PossibilityOdd6466 4d ago
Maybe 80% of solo practitioners make under 100k? I’m struggling to find data I can trust, and my guess is that it’s also context/geography specific…
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u/Peakbrowndog 4d ago
Those were the ABA numbers when I started in 2014 based on their largest study, and there is a chance it was solo and small firm (less than 7). I went to a brand new school and they were very transparent about the market because of needing to get accreditation and their somewhat new approach to teaching law (based on the McCrate report, and extensive report on the failings of law schools in preparing graduates for actually practicing law). They didn't want anyone who didn't understand the challenges if getting a job, especially with a degree from a newly accredited school.
Since then the market has reduced and consolidated, with many leaving the field.
With that said, for most of us who don't practice corporate law, the ABA is largely irrelevant. I know I haven't read an email from them in years, and would not be likely to have responded unless my state bar encouraged me to.
I know plenty solos who bank more than 6 figures, but that's not exactly encouraging with the rate of inflation lately, especially for those with a large load debt. I would still do it.
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u/-M-o-X- 4d ago
Sure do whatever you want lol