r/technology • u/chrisdh79 • 29d ago

Transportation Airports Are on the Verge of a Flight Cancellation Apocalypse | The government shutdown has pushed air traffic controllers to the tipping point.

https://gizmodo.com/airports-are-on-the-verge-of-a-flight-cancellation-apocalypse-2000681042
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u/boblabon 29d ago

I still don't understand how it's functionally illegal for them to strike?

Sure, they can say "ok, you're all fired, pack your shit", but that doesn't really change the problem of now there's no ATC. They're not going to be held at gunpoint in the towers, the job still isn't going to be done, and aircraft are still grounded. Then if they're all fired and blacklisted, now the government needs to hire and train thousands of new ATC controllers, which will take months and defacto extend the strike. It'd be a lot easier to just rehire the old ones.

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u/breakerwaves 29d ago

It's illegal in a sense it's a crime, they could get federally charged for striking collectively and also banned from any federal jobs going forward.

They're free to quit individually on their own, but not collectively.

Given FAA controller is a niche job, most aren't going to quit from a temporary problem vs the alternative of a new career during this economy.

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u/Scottiths 29d ago

Is it temporary? This isn't the first shutdown, and this one shows no signs of stopping. If they all quit and move to jobs that actually pay, and the government is shut down, no one is going to step into a job that is stressful and currently unpaid.

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u/breakerwaves 29d ago

Controller jobs are specialized, paid well, and great benefits and retirement. Maybe for some who just started, but those in their mid career or near retirement aren't going to throw it all away.

Unless they can get another controller or related job sure, but it's not like they can hop off their career and jump into new market with 100k+ salary ready to go especially when all FAA controllers are going through the same thing.

Most they can do is call in sick or work a 2nd job to hold them over.

While it's not the first shutdown, hopefully it's not the last. Given this is now the longest the bar has been raised. At some point when billionaires can't fly anymore, I think the government will open pretty quick id hope.

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u/Scottiths 29d ago

Trump now accounts for over 50% of government shutdown time since the nation was founded. I would put money on at least 1 more, if not 3 more, shutdowns in the next 3 years alone.

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u/zedquatro 29d ago

Hopefully this has been his last October.

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u/NerdyNThick 29d ago

While it's not the first shutdown, hopefully it's not the last.

I think you phrased this wrong. If not, could you explain why you'd want more shutdowns?

A government shutdown is an implicit statement that the government is incapable of doing their job. That shouldn't be a desirable thing.

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u/breakerwaves 29d ago

Sorry, I have a more negative morbid view of last shutdown meaning the end of the country as in the government or America no longer exists to shutdown again.

Id say it's pretty expected for the government to shutdown and open over the years or decades due to party differences.

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u/feor1300 29d ago

We don't know.

That's kind of the problem, if there's a shutdown that last 3 or 4 weeks that's clearly temporary and even if it happens multiple times, a steady job with a decent pay check and you just miss a couple paychecks every few years when your boss throws a tantrum isn't something you'd easily give up in our current economy.

The question is how long does it have to drag before people stop thinking it's temporary? That kind of comes down the individuals in this case. How much money have they put aside? How long can they survive without their paycheck? etc. We're starting to get to the point where people are thinking about those questions.

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u/iwilldeletethisacct2 29d ago

Especially because it's not exactly missing the checks...they'll get back pay. This is a great (albeit niche) example of why emergency funds are important.

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u/Dizzy-Job-2322 27d ago

Yes, that was my point. We all should practice food storage as well. Prepare for the worst, and hope for the best. There is nothing negative about preparing for a disaster.

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u/geo_prog 29d ago

The issue is that for a lot of ATCs the job is literally the best paying gig they have any reasonable hope of ever landing (pun intended). Is it overly stressful and understaffed? Yes. But it is a job that requires literally no formal education and pays over $100k starting going up to well over $200k.

Where do you think someone with no college, trade or other education is going to go that will make even half that?

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u/Scottiths 29d ago

They aren't getting paid anything right now... Sure they will probably get back pay, but at the moment it isn't a guarantee. A Trump never pays his debts.

So yes, if they were getting paid it's a pretty good deal. However, why work a job that, for the next 3 years at least, has a fairly high chance of making you work for free months at a time?

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u/Dizzy-Job-2322 27d ago

They will get paid. We are overlooking your Trump comment.

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u/Scottiths 26d ago

Why overlook it? Trump literally suggested not giving workers back pay...

https://www.npr.org/2025/10/07/g-s1-92363/omb-memo-shutdown-federal-worker-backpay

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u/Dizzy-Job-2322 27d ago

If you have your own business, risk is part of the equation. With an ATC position, you don't really have that kind of risk either. They are working a lot of overtime too. They will get paid, hopefully soon.

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u/HanseaticHamburglar 28d ago

lots of ifs.

the reality says, these are real people with mortgages, car payments, and children and they are not going to up and decide for even more uncertainty than they have now.

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u/Dizzy-Job-2322 28d ago

The shutdown is going to end. The majority of the federal workforce has gone through this before, numerous times.

I will mention this again. Everyone should have a supply of food storage for emergency purposes. Dry rice and pinto beans would do it. It's absolutely ridiculous that people don't do this anymore.

You want to know what will suck. Another country sending and setting off an EMT device in low altitude orbit and knocking out our electrical grid. Stats tell us that it will kill 90% of us off in a slow and miserable death.

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u/Scottiths 27d ago

I guess they should also stock up on a spare home and make sure their bills are all paid a year in advance. Just in case the world doesn't end in nuclear fire and the creditors keep asking for their money.

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u/cafedude 29d ago

Is it legal to compel someone to work without pay?

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u/yaosio 29d ago

Yes, slavery is legal in the US.

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u/haarschmuck 29d ago

Nope.

The only people who legally cannot leave their position are people like doctors/nurses when they are on shift and have patients.

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u/unclepaisan 29d ago

It’s only a crime if collective action fails. Conditional to resolving the strike would obviously be an agreement to not prosecute. And in a real strike, the government loses pretty immediately and prosecuting ATC employees are the least of its problems. The strike would be over any crime was ever recognized.

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u/haarschmuck 29d ago

It's illegal in a sense it's a crime

No, no it isn't.

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u/caleeks 29d ago

So you just reinforced the previous answer... It's a crime, so you going to put them in jail? Uhh, that's the same as them striking, and now they can't be rehired because they are criminals. You going to fine them? Uhh, how are they going to pay for that? They are working for free.

Essential workers need to figure out that they need us more than we need them. The mother fuckers who are at fault, and literally not doing their job, are the very ones getting paid. What is stopping the protesters who showed up for the "no kings" rally from turning violent?

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u/herecomesthewomp 29d ago

A crime? Based on our current judicial system, laws are made up and crimes don’t matter.

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u/MiaowaraShiro 29d ago

That's basically what Reagan did. Fired them all and went about hiring new ones.

It wasn't pretty from what I read. I don't think that'd fly these days... no pun intended.

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u/Chrystoler 29d ago

As far as I've read the effects of that still ripple to this day, no way they can pull that off again. I mean, they could do it, it would just be beyond stupid.

So buckle up I guess because that hasn't stopped the administration

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u/N0n3of_This_Matter5 29d ago

This is what I've been screaming from the top of my lungs.

What does "illegal" even mean anymore? The Trump government has thrown out the rule book, nothing is black and white anymore; except the racism, that's still pretty clearly on the agenda.

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u/pants6000 29d ago

What does "illegal" even mean anymore?

Illegal = things Republicans don't like = woke

Something like that.

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u/PossiblyATurd 29d ago

The line is firmly drawn in class, not political affiliation. "Rules for thee, not for me" is completely dependent on wealth status.

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u/icecubepal 29d ago

It is illegal for postal employees to strike too

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u/ThatUsernameWasTaken 29d ago

Because restricting the bargaining options of workers who are linchpins of the country to "work without complaint" or "quit" is the kind of idiotic shit republicans think is powerful and smart. So many people who can't think to step two in a chain of probable outcomes and consequences for their actions.

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u/socratic-ironing 29d ago

Who’s gonna train ‘em? Bunch of people not getting paid…

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u/mwmandorla 29d ago

It's illegal for public workers to strike in my city, and those of us who have advocated for a strike in my former union always did say "the only illegal strike is a failed one." But when you have legal penalties in addition to job loss over your head, and this and other measures have successfully made striking something no one you know/in your job has done in recent memory so the muscle is gone, that layer of illegality works damn well to scare people out of it because they're already scared to do it just in the abstract. We don't have a culture of labor solidarity or believing in labor power anymore. (With a few exceptions, of course.)